What Makes A Good Leader?

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As the owner of your business, you should have an inherent drive to achieve the goals and KPIs you set out and you know why you have to achieve them. But how do you consistently hold your team accountable to your goals when they have no reason to care beyond payday?

In this week’s episode of Cracking the Code, Matthew Bratsis of OPTIMUS Finance sits down with Matt Houts of Anderson Plumbing to discuss how to get your team to buy into your goals and build your business, even when you’re not watching them.

Audio Transcription (in Beta)

What makes a good leader? Well, you’re going to find out on today’s show.

Okay. Well, let’s get started with this week’s content today. We have the optimist team with some great content on leadership. So pay close attention, take it away team. What is it that you think makes a good leader? I know, I know you’re very highly respected as a leader. I know Donna talks about you all the time and there’s other people talk about, what is it that you think makes a good leader?

Um, well, uh, I don’t know. I guess I’m a good leader, but I think I said that I’m, I’m a very attentive one. I try to be available, uh, maybe do it all. Sometimes I will answer my phone at all hours at any time. And I figure if I’m getting a call after hours, it’s going to be really important. So, uh, I think maybe the annoyance of my wife, my family, I mean, I will pick up the phone, uh, I picked it up.

I had one of my sales people. She called. She had a truck was broken into and she texted me at 5 45. I called her right back. I think she’s blown away that I picked up the phone. But, um, I want them to know at all times that they can reach me and I can provide sort of, you know, guidance or help or whatever they need.

And I think that is probably the most important thing that they know that they can depend on you. And I kind of look at myself like, even though I’m younger than some of my sales people, I’m kind of the older brother, I probably have the most experience out of all of them, and I try to pass that on in any way that I can, help them in any way, always answer the phone.

Yeah, I think being available and having custom people, having your people know that you are, Accessible has got to be really important. I know Donna, that’s a really big thing for you. It is a big thing. I actually feel the same way, Matt. And if a contractor needs me and they call out of hours, um, they’ll, I’ll get calls on Saturdays and Friday nights when I’m out.

I’ll get a call from my contractor. I think I’ve done that a few times myself. If I have calls. You have, um, and I’ll pick up the phone because it is, I want my contractors and really even my team, if my team needs me as well, I want to make sure that I am there for them. Uh, that is a really good sign of a leader.

And I know Matthew is a good, does a good job of picking up the phone when we need him as well. So I think that’s a really good, uh, quality. Yeah, being, no, being accessible is incredibly important. They need to know that. You’re there for them for the support that they’ve got. Um, do you, I certainly, you guys have KPIs and you guys certainly have goals that you want to, that you kind of want to, um, you want to hold people accountable because accountability is important, right?

You have to know exactly what people are doing and you know, if they don’t have a goal, what It’s your job to coach them to that goal. So obviously, but tell us a little bit about that. Are you, um, you know, do you, are you more of a micromanager where you work with them on a, on a regular basis? And you’re asking how many calls they’re making or how many, like, tell us about kind of the style that you’ve got with people that, that you seem to be working for you.

Um, I wouldn’t call it like laissez faire, but I really am not a micromanager. Um, uh, I watch a lot of movies and. There was a director, John Houston, who once said that a lot of times when he’s making the movie, a lot of the work is before he even shoots any film, is in the casting. So if you hire the right people, you just kind of let them do their jobs.

I mean, especially if they’re new, you’re definitely going to be working with them a little more intensively. But, um, my number one, I really don’t get into, I mean, unless she needs me to, or she’s asking. Uh, if she has a. A couple of days where she’s uh having a rough time There’s anything I can do but I know she always comes right back.

So I was in sales. I know it can be very up and down You’re really gonna have to have uh, quite a cluster of bad Days going into weeks and months before i’m really going to step in of course if they ask i’m always right there but The kpi’s I mean if i’ve hired somebody I have a lot of faith in them already Um A lot of times it’s just a matter of what I have to do to really kind of activate that, um, and, uh, whether it’s ride along, I mean, I’ll just kind of intensively work with one person.

I almost kind of 1 percent might be the lowest person on totem pole, and I’ll just work with them, get them up, and then I can always work on the next guy with the lowest. And then, of course, when I’m doing that, I mean, calling me about other issues that are having I’m working with, but, um, Uh, no, I, uh, you know, I have, I, I hire adults.

I don’t have to necessarily get in their business all the time. Uh, I mean, I look over the numbers every day and the jobs they went on. And if there’s a, uh, I’m really big about leaving options and if they don’t leave enough options, and I see that consistently, I might check in with them, see what that’s about.

But if it’s one or two there, I figure there’s probably a pretty good reason. You know, I don’t want them to think I’m constantly eagle eyeing every minute of the day what they’re doing. Yeah, I know, I know from my perspective a lot of times, um, I manage kind of differently depending upon the person that I’m actually, that’s on my team.

Because I do know that, like, everybody works in their kind of, their own way. They, they learn on their own, in their own methodology. Some are audio learners, some need to, the visualization. So you really kind of, in my opinion, you really got to kind of. Know the, the employee that you’ve got and if you don’t understand them, it’s really going to be hard to connect.

And I know Donna, this is a big thing with you because you have talked multiple times about us, about you like very clear either direction or lists or very clear, no, and that, and again, I like numbers, right? You like numbers, whereas I have other people who literally, You’re absolutely right. Get out of the way, Matthew, just don’t worry about, uh, about us and we’ll, and we’ll check in later.

And I know this is a big thing for you, right? I like to be judged, I guess, I don’t know what the answer is to that, but I like numbers. I like to see my performance and if I’m not doing as well as that I think that I am doing, I pick up the pace a little bit or, um, if I’m doing really well, I’ll take the week off.

I’m only kidding. No, you’re not kidding, but that’s, but that’s perfectly fine. No, it is. You’re so right about that. If you can read an employee and, and you know, a team member and you can figure out what’s going to inspire them, um, in a certain way. We all get inspired different ways. If you’re somebody that can read that, that’s a really good quality as well.

The question I have for you, Matt, is from a sales function, you know, the sales managing a sales team is very different than managing, managing an administrative team, and I’m willing to bet it’s significantly different managing a, a, a sales team. Team of technicians, right? I mean, I got to think that there’s very much a different process behind the sales and the and the technicians.

And if we focus on sales right now, because it’s really primarily what your direction is, um, is it, you know, is it are they driven by bonuses and the mighty dollar or are they driven by Um, By a pat on the back or they driven by just you’re looking for people that are kind of self driven where you’re not having to Supplement those those issues.

I’m just curious like what your thoughts are there Well a couple of things as I said, uh, I don’t find so much a difference between male and female But it is a generational one. I definitely see I’m, uh, I guess with the marketers we call like a gen xer. I think you guys are Gen x around the same age I find that for being here.

I’m sure you were going somewhere else there with that I am I am i’m the very first gen xers what I am

I do find that they’re a little more self sufficient and they as uh, it sounds like how donna likes to work They like clear guidelines and pretty much just step back and you know, I don’t usually have the right to ship too much with them um Uh, or I guess that’s not really the right term, I guess, in terms of a lot of, uh, uh, work and, uh, I don’t get nearly as many phone calls as I do from the younger ones, where am I doing this right?

Do I do this or I do that? And I really, I think with the younger ones have to let them know. I really sort of trust. I always tell them, use your best judgment. And I kind of walked them through it. A lot of times, uh, the younger ones will be calling me about stuff that I know they know the answer to, and I just sort of have to have them kind of arrive to it.

The older ones, I generally don’t get that. Um, so, uh, but in terms of what motivates them, uh, Yeah, I mean they all like recognition, but I think salespeople are kind of uniquely sort of mercenary I guess they’re really Really are ultimately in it for the money and that’s it’s not a bad thing. Uh, so no Bonuses, we have a pretty nice bonus program set up when they hit certain.

Uh milestones we we have bonus checks and uh That’s one of the things I make sure that they get the bonuses right away. Uh, there’s no playing around with it. There’s no Whoa You know, I know some sales managers want guys to sort of track their own numbers. I track them actively, let them know, Hey, you’re only 50, 000 away from this milestone and I make sure they have the check right away.

The, uh, our controller, I think I maybe stepped on her toes a little bit, but, uh, it’s, it’s all worth it. So I, I do have a, I do have a, a natural question that comes to mind from a financing standpoint. We have a lot of contractors, a lot of dealers that will hold And maybe that I don’t want to be saying this question wrong and setting you up incorrectly, right?

I don’t want to throw too much of a softball to you. But, um, does, does using, utilizing finance or utilizing programs that have a dealer cost. Does that affect a salesperson’s commission structure in any way? Sure. Um, yeah, that is a, uh, uh, apply towards the calculation. I mean, we pay every week, but it’s on jobs from two weeks before, so we can get all the subcontractors or financing in, um, one of the things that I was saying, uh, but in terms of options, the other component of that is financing always offer financing.

Okay. And one of the things that I liked really with the optimist is just that they can just put the name in you get a Soft win inquiry and then you don’t have to resell it if maybe on the first look they didn’t get it yet So that’s something that’s worked out really well Like well, and you don’t have to have really that uncomfortable conversation with somebody.

This is what you qualify for You don’t have to tell them, well, you didn’t qualify for this, but you qualify for this. And, uh, you just go straight to it. So that coupled with the options, uh, I think you’re definitely going to help with the closing percentages. And, uh, well, frankly, with the financing, it helps with the average sale, which we’re.

sale. No, that’s, that’s that because a lot of tim contractors who maybe don sales organizations you h to them when they’re, som organizations that when t have used financing, they the dealer fees directly Kind of teaching a salesperson not to be using a tool that’s going to help them close a bigger sale So the question is you’re embracing finance and you guys are presetting all of your You’re kind of pre setting all the plans that they can use, correct?

Correct. Right. Yeah, uh, Go ahead. Oh, I’m sorry. Whether it’s Greek, IFPL, yeah, we have those all sort of, uh, taken, uh, beforehand. I’m sorry. Please go ahead. Right. And they know what they, you’ve given them clear direction on when they can use, say, and again, I’m completely making things up, so it’s not like I see access to what you guys are using or not using, right?

If they want to use at this particular time a zero for 60, which is a significant dealer fee, you might have that plan. Do you allow them to use, do you allow them the freedom to use what they need at the time? Or do you have it set up so that they can all use certain plans with certain product? Well, uh, they have a bank of them to work with.

And, uh, when I talked to them, I mean, you really, one of the things when you’re a salesperson is you have to kind of keep a running tally in your head on what you’re discounting or what’s costing for the job. So if you’re putting a higher, uh, maybe that has more of a bite from the financing, you may not be able to discount it nearly as much, or if you’re ready to take that.

Cut you might be able to do it, but you should know exactly what you’re dealing with when when you’re doing it And I think that’s something that for a salesperson. I can really only come with experience It is how to try to keep that map going in your head, but it is applied to the uh, those bills and recalculation Yeah, no, and that’s again.

It’s it’s fascinating. The the goal was to not allow it to become a detriment to your, to your people. It should be a skill they learn. Um, another facet that I would love to talk to you a little bit about. I’m sorry. No, let me just treat like the brain of the electrician or, you know, whatever. And you’re okay.

So another aspect that I’m really fascinated with that I hear talking a lot about leadership, and I know this is something that we have to work on. Internally, a little bit better ourselves is, um, ongoing education, ongoing training within employees, right? It’s, it’s really habit, and again, we fall into the habit sometimes of, okay, they know their job, they’ve got the skills, and then you find yourself going, Way too long between opportunities to sit down and kind of train and we should actually do it.

I say this to Eric, our sales manager all the time. It’s like, it should be like batting practice. And I know you’re a baseball fan, by the way, um, which is, which is interesting because The title of this one is Quarterbacking a Two Minute Drill because it’s all about leading your field. It’s football season, leading your field on this, and you’re telling me you’re a baseball Padres fan, so, um, I guess it’s, I guess we should be talking about closing, ninth inning closing, not, uh, not a Quarterbacking a Two Minute Drill, but can we talk about your training?

Do you, Like is training how heavily do you invest in training and do you have an ongoing kind of non stop process? I’m assuming you do Yeah, um, well when we bring somebody on and like I said a lot of times we do have folks that have no prior experience in the industry, so Uh the first two months the first eight weeks and I have gone a little more than that is that they’re doing ride alongs with every single uh, they’re with every single uh person on the sales team or number one to some of the newer folks and The thing that’s important also is you got to make sure that those guys Don’t micromanaging are really sort of following the process also Uh, we also have them and within that time they’re watching the EGIA videos or above and long videos, uh, which have the nice little, uh, uh, I know you’re attached to the EGIA and the little quizzes at the end.

I always tell them that, uh, uh, it’s probably best to just take the quiz. They’re short little quizzes after each video. They’re about five or six questions. I say, just keep taking them until you get 100. If you have to, just watch it again. And they’re self paced, so eight weeks they should be able to go through all those pretty quickly.

That’s sort of just a basic kind of boot camp. The thing with heating and air in terms of sales techniques, a lot of it is really only going to come with experience. In terms of the technical, yes, this morning we just had somebody out from Daikin doing training on ducted mini splits. And, uh, I try not to inundate them with, you know, Too much too long all at once and try to make it fun I mean a lot of times i’ll i’ll have breakfast.

We have a nice group. Everyone’s, uh familiar with each other better joking around uh, so Yeah, we tend to have about one training, uh a week On various aspects, uh, or we’ll have maybe our field supervisors talk about maybe duct issues a lot of times I find that when we’re having some sort of issue in terms of A problem it will hit a few jobs We get them in clusters and we’ll sort of talk about in very general terms not singling anyone out But just trying to keep a constant rolling, uh pouring knowledge in their head job walks are a big thing also Uh, we have them job walker just about every single job, especially in the green if there’s anything that they may have missed Working with the installers that maybe they should know for the future Um, but it’s just constant kind of At all angles, uh, knowledge coming in.

So I do want to touch on, on, uh, something you mentioned there, which is, which is fun. So Matt, you talk, and I think this is really one of the most underrated things. I think people want to have fun at their job, right? Everybody wants to be successful. And. Like anything, if we go back to the quarterbacking a two minute drill, nothing’s more fun than winning, right?

Let’s just acknowledge that from the start, right? Nothing’s more fun than winning. So when you close the sale and you get a big ticket, that’s fun. Doesn’t matter, doesn’t matter what else you’re doing inside the organization. That’s fun. But there are going to be times where the organization has to make participatory so that you keep people kind of valuing the culture and valuing what they’re doing.

So what are you guys doing or what do you do to kind of keep it fresh, keep it fun, keep people kind of involved in things? Well, uh, uh, we are a big believer here at Anderson. We take the personality tests, the color code tests. I don’t know if you guys are familiar with that. We’re developed, uh, it’ll divide personalities with red, blue, yellow.

Uh, red is kind of more of a type A personality. Let me guess, you’re looking for lots of pink. Yeah, exactly. Yellow is more of a fun one. And nobody is all one color. Everybody is, uh, uh, We’re in a new office here and I had a chart where, uh, Kind of each person on what their dominant color is on a magnet and just kind of as a reminder when I’m talking to them sort of, uh, uh, dealing with them as an individual.

Mine is a yellow, which is a lot of, uh, well, fun. Uh, so, uh, yeah, I do like to keep it light. I like to keep it short. I know when I was a salesperson that I like my meetings not super long and drawn out. Uh, I like to get to the information, the most important stuff. And, uh, I find they’re much more receptive to it if, if, if we’re keeping it kind of light and, uh, and try to foster a atmosphere where anyone can ask questions that there’s no sort of judgment.

We all run into things a lot of times I’ll ask the question that, uh, I think maybe they might be, uh, I’m not, I’m not afraid to make an ass of myself.

Pens coming on here. Hey, Matt, what happens? What happens when you have, um, a disrupter, an employee or a team member that, um, doesn’t quite fit in with the whole team. Maybe they’re, uh, disgruntled or something. Do you give them time to work it out? Or do you know right away that this person is not going to work with your team?

Well, I think everybody, you really, especially if you hired them, uh, maybe you had an idea about them and, uh, you know, I think you want to give anyone Uh, the chances to sort of reform themselves, we do get folks though, that occasionally, not many, but, uh, maybe where they have a difficult personality.

Salespeople, as I said, I mean, there is an aspect where some of us can be a little bit kind of prima donnas, where we have some real producers might. My number one, uh, I mean, I think the world of her I mean, she’s among the easiest uh, she is by far my easiest one, uh, she almost doesn’t even need a man so tell her I said that but uh, but a lot of times Where you get them like that, uh at some point The toxicity they’re going to bring to the atmosphere.

I mean, it just outweighs whatever problems they’re going to, uh, whatever production they’re going to have. I mean, they’re going to have problems with the sales people. They’re going to have problems with the installers and it’s just, it’s just not worth it. So a lot of times though, it seems counterintuitive.

You’re going to have to, at some point, probably just cut them off. Cause they’re going to affect the whole team. Well, thank you so much to our Optimist team for coming in and presenting that information. It’s amazing content as always. We really appreciate it. Now, listen, be sure and share this on Facebook.

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We’ll see you next time. Until then, bye bye for now.